Bitcoin to $1,000,000 by 2030? | Muneeb Ali
In this episode of Talking Tokens, Jacquelyn Melinek speaks with Muneeb Ali, founder of Stacks, about navigating his fourth bear market and why this one feels different as AI could potentially offer higher growth than crypto for the first time. Muneeb explains why quantum computing poses a real threat to Bitcoin even before quantum computers exist, and why some Bitcoin hardliners refuse to acknowledge the problem. He walks through the evolution of Bitcoin DeFi from peak excitement in 2024 to maturation in 2025, why BTC yield has product-market fit, and how Stacks is launching self-custodial Bitcoin staking with 3-7% yields. The conversation covers its $400M+ in BTC rewards already paid out, why institutions want Bitcoin-denominated returns and why Bitcoin maturing with yield capabilities will help traditional banks offer it to clients even if hardliners don't like BlackRock's involvement. TIMESTAMPS
(00:00) Intro (01:24) How his 4th bear market feels different with AI competing with crypto (04:47) Quantum computing threat to Bitcoin and why hardliners won't acknowledge it (07:04) Bitcoin's path to quantum resistance (12:26) What happens to Satoshi's Bitcoin and lost coins in quantum future (14:44) Bitcoin to $1M by 2030: conviction despite slower appreciation rates (17:27) Bitcoin DeFi evolution from 2024 to 2025 (21:06) Bitcoin collateral: yield and lending product-market fit (28:55) Why institutions want BTC-denominated yields (31:10) What changed culturally to make Bitcoin staking acceptable to holders (34:55) Self-custodial Bitcoin staking: earn 3-7% with BTC in your hardware wallet
ESSENTIALS You can subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple or YouTube. If you enjoy the show, please leave a review — it really helps. Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0LOgWxIQ0NnNUD5eXsSuoZ Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/talking-tokens/id1743669141 Follow us on X Jacquelyn: https://twitter.com/jacqmelinek Talking Tokens: https://twitter.com/_TalkingTokens Follow us on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/_talkingtokens/ Note: This podcast is for informational purposes only. Views shared are opinions, not financial advice. The host or guests may have financial interests in discussed content.
Bitcoin to $1,000,000 by 2030? | Muneeb Ali
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A 117-Year-Old Asset Manager Goes “Fully Native,” Seeing Tokenization as OS upgrade | Theo Golden
On today's Talking Tokens, Jacquelyn sits down with Theo Golden, Head of Digital Assets at Baillie Gifford, to talk about BAGEY — the firm's newly launched tokenized bond fund on Solana and Ethereum that yields around 7% and settles in USDC. Theo breaks down why he sees tokenization as an operating system upgrade rather than a reinvention of finance, how pension funds and private banks are already showing real interest in its new tokenized fund, and why he thinks AI democratizing insight and tokenization democratizing access are two themes that will collide into something nobody has fully figured out yet. DISCLAIMER: Although our guest this week works at Baillie Gifford, nothing in this podcast should be considered an offer of its investment advisory services or should otherwise be confused for investment, tax, legal or other financial advice. This episode is a part of the Solana Sessions campaign that Token Relations and the Talking Tokens podcast are doing, diving into founders' journeys and startups building on Solana. Check out the accompanying newsletter on www.token-relations.com TIMESTAMPS: 00:00 His Journey to Digital Assets 03:33 From Journalism to Investment Theses 06:05 Learning from Successes and Failures 10:15 The Role of Independence in Baillie Gifford’s Innovation 15:19 Gradual Growth in Tokenization 20:57 Tokenization as an Operating System Upgrade 23:57 Convincing Clients of Tokenization's Value 24:50 Operational Leverage and Risk Management 27:12 The Origin of Baillie Gifford’s BAGEY Tokenized Fund 32:18 Initial Response and Market Interest 34:43 Choosing Solana and Ethereum for the Fund Launch 38:33 Solana and The Future of Internet Capital Markets 43:09 Trust and Adoption Among Institutional Investors 46:07 The Role of Traditional Institutions in Tokenization 47:59 AI and Tokenization: A Future Intersection You can subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple or YouTube. If you enjoy the show, please leave a review — it really helps. Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0LOgWxIQ0NnNUD5eXsSuoZ Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/talking-tokens/id1743669141 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TalkingTokens Follow us on X Jacquelyn: / jacqmelinek Talking Tokens: / _talkingtokens Follow us on Instagram / _talkingtokens Note: This podcast is for informational purposes only. Views shared are opinions, not financial advice. The host or guests may have financial interests in discussed content.
Why Plasma Bet Everything on USDT When Nobody Believed in Stablecoin Chains | Zaheer Evtakar, Plasma
On today's Talking Tokens, Jacquelyn sits down with Zaheer Ebtikar, Chief Strategy Officer at Plasma, to talk about why the recent wave of DeFi exploits is forcing a necessary reset and Plasma’s decision behind building a stablecoin-optimized chain around USDT. Zaheer also dives into the recent OpenUSD launch and how it can fit into an institutional stablecoin infrastructure world,, and why he thinks the biggest unlock still ahead is making it invisible enough that billions of people just use it without knowing it's there. TIMESTAMPS: 0:36 - Thoughts on DeFi Exploits & Reconsolidation 3:59 - Plasma's Stablecoin Strategy 5:48 - Investor Pushback & Conviction 9:07 - Lessons Since Launch 12:46 - USDT & OpenUSD 17:29 - The Stablecoin Landscape 21:31 - What Makes a Durable Team 24:55 - DeFi's Future 30:49 - Advice for Founders 40:57 - Plasma's Big Bets & Token Strategy 45:53 - Long-Term Vision for DeFi You can subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple or YouTube. If you enjoy the show, please leave a review — it really helps. Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0LOgWxIQ0NnNUD5eXsSuoZ Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/talking-tokens/id1743669141 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TalkingTokens Follow us on X Jacquelyn: / jacqmelinek Talking Tokens: / _talkingtokens Follow us on Instagram / _talkingtokens Note: This podcast is for informational purposes only. Views shared are opinions, not financial advice. The host or guests may have financial interests in discussed content.
Tapping a Credit Card to Buy Coffee With Bitcoin Is…Kinda Wrong | Strata Research
On this edition of Strata Research, Jacquelyn sits down with institutional research analyst Alex Beaudry to dig into crypto cards, which many assumed were built for consumers but are actually seeing most traction from institutions. Alex breaks down why the developed market consumer card is basically a feature in search of a need, what Visa is building that could change the equation, and why onchain credit could be the piece of this stack that makes or breaks the whole argument. Check out the associated Strata Research report for more details: https://www.token-relations.com/p/the-real-story-behind-crypto-cards TIMESTAMPS: 01:21 - What a crypto card actually is and how it works under the hood 03:04 - Why the developed market consumer card hasn't taken off — and may never 07:22 - Where the real value actually is: B2B and institutional usage 08:39 - The acquisition wave and why infrastructure is the real prize 11:46 - Onchain credit: what works and what's still broken 14:01 - What to watch over the next 6–24 months You can subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple or YouTube. If you enjoy the show, please leave a review — it really helps. Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0LOgWxIQ0NnNUD5eXsSuoZ Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/talking-tokens/id1743669141 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TalkingTokens Follow us on X Jacquelyn: / jacqmelinek Talking Tokens: / _talkingtokens Follow us on Instagram / _talkingtokens Note: This podcast is for informational purposes only. Views shared are opinions, not financial advice. The host or guests may have financial interests in discussed content.